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He was not amused at all and later ripped me up on his no comment blog. Or even the likes of Jack Chick. I cant say that I have (not that Im an authority, and Id be happy to learn otherwise). The Book of Shemaiah the Prophet[10] I think those pictures and especially the insinuations about prof. Beckwith are rather offensive, yet we should not waste our time with enganging in vain discussions. It cries out for a Caliph or a Pope or a Poll-Driven Ministry, whatever will work. WHY DONT YOU ALLOW COMMENTS ON YOUR BLOG LIKE JIMMY? I think history paints a very different picture from the above, and from this point on, I think the other posts on this blog pick up where I leave off. The Chronicles of the Kings of Media and Persia[22] Back to the point, the setup smells. He has authored or contributed to more than twenty four books, including The King . It is hard to take back a joke but real easy to pull pictures off a website. And the illogic of sola scriptura is so simple: Its not in the scriptures. So no one should respond to Hittchens or Dawkins because they are sometimes offensive? every denomination and every independent church has its own magesterium, tradition. Funny. That alone should be enough to appease some people but as of this writing, the pictures are still there. The egos are getting out in force, mine included. If people want to continue these largely pointless discussions, can they at the very least Catholics and Protestants be charitable. For one thing, it was the first time that the various powers of Europe had a different religion altogether, and so therefore had the temptation to shed blood on a massive scale. You may think that I am misguided, but that is what I truly believe. This applies to both sides in every situation. Because of the nature of the issue and the points I will address, I ask for clemency for what will surely be both a long and late-in-the-game post. When I discovered that the pope agreed with all of my theology and teaching I had discovered in the Bible, I felt it better that I go with the group The lack of charity on James White part guarantees that his arguments (and he doubtless has some) will fall on deaf ears. Your inability and/or unwillingness to consider ideas outside of your own conjecture, We are called by God to go beyond the veil of darkness and become what Chesterton calls an outpost of light. This is all just incredibly sad. Oh, and if you somehow think Jimmy Akins rebuke is overdue, it behooves you to prove that Akin was aware of it in the first place. Has the New Testament Been Accurately Transmitted? I challenge you to back up your words with evidence showing where Dr. White has always proclaim(ed) victory. Isnt that a littleobsessive? Honest. What makes you think I am refering specifically to Catholics. I cannot relate to you the ugliness that came out of that event. I was raised Catholic but have been Protestant for over 30 years. So, was he saying that Roman soldiers came back from the dead? Even has a picture of a little troll doll and talks trash about Jimmy. so his path towards You would be made clearer. Does he give account of his ministrys collections and how he spends his time and resources? Will you still EVADE the question??? And the Protestants see what they see and think its reasonable to do what they do in order to be consistent with what they believe Christ wants. So you respond. judgment by virtue of his humor on some of the blogging Catholics who have contacted him about what they perceive as a lack of charity (and his humor is doing this or could be taken Admin Name:to attn. I dont think the same can be said for Robert Sungenis but I am not completely conscious of the situation so its difficult to comment intelligently. And, why it is not clear to all of us who seek Gods will? Somehow, I see visions of Wyle Coyote and a steamroller. Heck, I am part of it for even commenting but its like the accident on the side of the road, you know, the one where you cant help but stare :(. Author==>writes book Canon==>canon contains 1 book(artifact of Revelation) If its good enough to post on a ministry blog, then its good enough for the other media. lemmetry to summarize his points: I appreciate the kind comment though. 3. No I dont and I never did so Id appreciate it if youll write a recantation to that accusation. I have noticed that White has been especially hysterical about the Beckwith situation. Again, heres the full quote: First tell us, what race are the Germans? Thank you for your kind sentiments and defending me against the false witness of that Bear-ish brood. I did a Whois search and found out this info: teach the heresy of Lordship Salvation. Super encouraging stuff from the trip so far, including last nights presentation on the Trinity and Oneness theology. Why is Bishop White so concerned with lay Catholic apologists? In other words, if I have a list of books I say was divinely inspired and you have a different (although overlapping) list of books that you say was divinely inspired, which (if either) is the correct list, and how does one make that determination? Consider that he has now written extensive multiple blog entries to justify what should have been an obvious mistake in his reading of Frank Beckwith to any reasonable person. 2Thes 2:15: ohperhaps research the concepts in catholic moral theology of rash judgement. Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church (Matt. I mean seriously, I bet you guys have Jimmy Akin/James White action figures and White is wearing a Darth Vader helmet. 2. With such comments as such a thing fits the logic and attitude of the mob though and I think this characterizes the attitude of Akins crew well and, oddly enough, corresponds with the general attitude of ignorant zeal held by those in the doctored photographs.; is there any doubt as to what CareBears motives were from the very start? Stubble, First you assert there is no reason, then you observe it could be done to discredit Catholics. He is the author of more than twenty books and is an accomplished debater. I implore Dr. White to revise his pictures. Lets keep in mind the context of said quotation marks. How do you read it? Demands for combox explanations are usually futile. Q reads too many Ehrman and Pagels books. Begging the question of when you proved that such a thing was true. James White is the director of Alpha and Omega Ministries, a Christian apologetics organization based in Phoenix, Arizona. Everyone else, you know what you need to do. That doesnt mean everything he does is bad. Thats an act of charity if ever there was one. Might be time for some kind of update to these. Less than two days. Take care and God bless, I wasnt replying to him. The Apostles were empowered by our Saviour to forgive sins: This is the same type of answer Dr. Beckwith was giving in his interview with Koukl. That would be tedious. St. Paul said why I want him to address the real issues White raised But all available evidence is that inconsistency has nothing to do with his annoyance. Crowne Publications, reprinted by Bethany House 1993, Rudolph Boshoff, South African Theological Seminary, 2019 Apologetics Conference, Stanmore Baptist Church, Sydney, Australia, Antioch Bible Church, Johannesburg, South Africa, Knox Reformed Presbyterian Church, Mechanicsville, VA, American Family Association, Laurel, Mississippi, Hillcrest Baptist Church, KwaZulu Natal, South Africa, 2016 Apologetics Conference, Stanmore Baptist Church, Sydney, Australia, Hope Reformed Baptist Church, Underwood, Australia, Apologetics Conference Christ Presbyterian Church, Magna, UT, Defending the Faith Conference, Christ Community Church, West Covina, CA, 2011 Psalm 119 Conference, Minneapolis, MN, Bethal Grace Baptist Church, Bellflower, CA, Discern Conference, Gospel Life Community Church, Santa Fe, Grace Reformed Baptist Church, Merrick, NY, Trinity Reformed Baptist Church, La Mirada, CA, The Authority of Scripture Conference, Seattle Airport Marriot, Seattle, WA, Grace Reformed Baptist Church, Wake County, NC, Getting Over the Hurdles of the New World Translation (29,3), Summary Critique: How Wide the Divide? Christ said: Amen, amen, I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter into, the kingdom of God (John 3:5). Your original question was why we go to Priests to have our sins loosed. That is a horrendous thought, and much as we might dislike White or Carebear, they do not want to be disobedient to Christ. Perhaps you do with the rest of the Akin crew, as Akin seems to have used the pictures and some dubious Law from wikipedia to claim victory. please read the beautiful words of Romans 4:5-6 about the Now, on to another topic. If Jimmy had failed in his attempts at humor, I would have been morally bound to repeat the analysis in his case. This is simply NOT funny. On my websites I block referrals from several large websites such as digg and slashdot. To infer such is illogical. And I would not analogize it to Rome, but for the lessons of a well documented history, connecting clearly the dots between sacral thinking and the eventual death and destruction such thinking begets. PS- Again, you maliciously characterize folks without any evidence whatsoever, just as you have Catholic Answers here! how do you determine what is Scripture and what is not??? We can trust the canon mediated because of Gods promise of the effectual mediation of Gods Word. It is Augustines antithesis all over again. We dont have that luxury, since were not God. Actually, if he was influencing my kids and drawing people away from truth; you bet I would, in a flash. It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified but whom God raised from the dead, that this man stands before you healed. Finally, I would like to make some comments regarding James Whites supposed openness to the truth. I suppose I should brush up on my regulations though, that or Mr. Akin should deal with the issues. Lets see, who else could jump on in here and pick up where Mr. White has left off, you know, and elevate the spirit of Christian charity towards the Catholic brothers and sisters (in Christ of course). Wordy and vague, his take on the canon is basically, Well, its all very electrical and scientific. In drama, hyperbole is exaggeration not meant as an equivalent. As at least one person has suggested above, its time to stop feeding the energy machine. Why would they have believed in Sola Scriptura? Dean thank you greatly; I have no trouble with you repeating it, since it seems that the prior times had no effect.. He (Dr Beckwith) repeatedly (two out of three aint bad) left his readers/listeners with the distinct impression that he had not read Trent until recently and insulted his former Lutheran professors by indicating they had led him to expect: to read this sort of horrible document, you know, requiring people to stick pins in their eyes, you know, and flagellate themselves, you know, 2 Corinthians 10:17&18 That many people cant all be wrong absent a huge conspiracy and at this point it seems more charitable to believe that White really is rather off-putting than to conclude that all his opponents are in some sort of sinister league with each other. JAMES GALLERY. There are some points of resemblance between Christendom and its imitation in Islam; for that matter there are some points of resemblance between Jews and Gypsies. Thank you, Constantine. Amazing so since theyre dead, they dont know anything??? Can you imagine if these had been doctored photos of German SS holding signs saying something like, Gas those who lack charity.? If you want to know how much merit this accusation has, picture someone saying this after inhaling helium. Registrant ID:DI_471115 with his own ad hominems. Biting again When an author writes a book, a canon of his or her writing is automatically created as a result of the simple consideration that he or she has written at least one book If hes merely assuming, how is now judging? a. Can you imagine trying to market the Church of Trent in the modern context? Phoenix apologist, James White, became enraged, as the church was that of his daughter's and the man receiving the tattoo in the video was his son-in-law. I was addressing the Roman Catholic apologetics community. Jeff has been married to his bride, Candi, for over 20 years. But that said, take his substance as substance. The implication of moral equivalency is outrageous and disgusting. I will not argue this point with him. BRAIN IMPLODING. _____________ That would be tedious. The Prayer of Joseph Interesting that White is presents himself as so learned and yet is either unaware of or above basic human psychology. If you have read at all, I already showed how I believe God used the church body to reveal divine canon to us. CAIR uses that argument too. While the people who claim to be on his side are yammering for the next stunt. Hey, phone him up and see. Jimmy just seems to me to give very good example in this particular area. Godwins Law is limited to comparisons with Nazis and Hitler. Though he carelessly places his comments on his ministry website, I would hope they are not one and the same. Every single non-denomination of Protestantism, on the other hand, is a doctrine of salvation unto itself open only to her vaunted members who have the cunning to see Pastor So-and-so is right. I would simply point out that the changes to the pictures maintain the theme of attempting to bring death. A reverse lookup of the addresses shows that one is hosted by theplanet.com (I use the same one for a personal site), and the other at dewdesigns.net. And if he truly looks down on folks who would defend an Internet Apologist, what of the fact that he is defending James White, who is also an Internet Apologist by the same virtue? So we cant just sit back with the radical Muslim theme itself but have to flow with the artists changes as well. It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified but whom God raised from the dead, that this man stands before you healed. Wouldnt a cursory reading of history reveal that everyone just showed up, and then upon coming to a simple agreement of what they all know to be true, headed home? of Mapname.com customer 3 First, I am the Anonymous that Mary (of Kay) thinks is Eric. Sorry. If he did it intentionally, that would make him a liar. Thus, I also ask you to pray for me. without considering that there might, just might possibly be an alternate explanation For that matter WHY would someone go through the bother?. Gwen, go back to the post I quoted. I get credit for the work I do at my job, but it doesnt involve taking glory that belongs to God. Face it, some folk get a kick out of kicking over ant hills. Prejudiced. Islamist= radical Muslim, not to be confused with the non-murderous Muslims. I accused Esau of knowingly committing fallacy, and dilineated exactly how he did it. Well if wikipedia says itit must be true. Once Gods spirit moved upon the very first author of Scripture, cannon (infallible) came into existence. Fixed Dates 2. I dont know nor do I need to know to what extent that influences your intellectual arguments. Since Mr White is apparently reading everything with his name on it, & since he has no combox (probably a wise move, considering what I feel like posting there): Why is anyone responding to CareBear? Or did James White merely find a convenient way to win a debate without ever having to defend a word he says by posting these pictures and the other tactics he has relied on in his debate with Beckwith? Lets be honest, if it were anyone other than him posting pictures like that people wouldnt be reacting in such a manner. Ditto his successors, the Caliphsor at least the first four, the so-called rightly-guided Caliphs. Slander is saying something not true, so perhaps you should consider what exactly youre saying before you go shooting your keyboard off. Evangelical Seminary (formerly Faraston Seminary). 4) To that end, everything that happens to James White reflects wonderfully on him and proves his case beyond a shadow of a doubt. Let me share with you one of the Rules of Strider for Apologetics (and I am making this up off the top of my head): As I already stated, I assumed the url was their doing, because any able-minded, reasonable person would firgure that a url naturally belongs to the site it displays. with Kevin Johnson, What Every Christian Should Know About the Quran. Its time to step back and stop getting involved in feuds with White and people like him, which often turn personal and very nasty (on both sides). Is everything in Foxes book of martyrs a mere fabrication? -CareBear. I dont need to read everything hes written about every topic in order to engage in discussion about a single topic. All Rights Reserved. Or how silly and pathetic it is? Try explaining it in your own words so that a simpleton like me can understand. Moreover, no Emperor regarded himself as the priest of his imperium. Offensiveness per se doesnt preclude response. I havent read the book by Dr. White. That includes urging one another the abandon wrong paths, and always acting in love. Well, lets seeby awarding him a casuistry degree, you are accusing him of specious reasoning. My Reply What did you expect, applause? Third, it actually produces a queasy feeling in my gut when I spend a couple of hours trying to put together a good, meaningful post, that expresses legitimate disappointment in the theocracy (definitely a theocracy) promoted by Rome, only to have it thrown off as utter nonsense. Some humble someone mopping a floor in Guam may end up with rewards greater than the most visible believers in human history. 4. Eileen and Simple Sinner, yes and Im glad you spelled it out. I wasnt responding to Matthew originally, his request happened to coincide with my refutation of Esau via quotation of Whites own book about sola Scriptura. God graciously saved Zack at the age of 18 and hes been committed to serving the local church since day 1. Was the New Testament Reliably Transmitted from its Authors? Otherwise, we should have known nothing at all about it God used the blood of many martyrs to give you a bath you desperately needed. Excerpt from Whites blog article: Assertion 1) Beckwith is a liar. 2.John 1:1,2 says are quite good at presenting this, and doing it in an easy to understand manner at the same time, when the situation is appropriate for such discussions. I share it. every religious leader (they aren't Biblical Christians) who teach Lordship By accepting Whites actions as the just due that is neither just nor due (unless you truly understand Gods intentions here), we rise above the muck and elicit the surprise of every mudskipper and bottom-dweller that never could. Ive decided not to give up on this, in spite of a few disappointing setbacks, of which I also have been partly at fault. Indulgences? More ad hominem. accurately analogize it to jihad-think My identity is bound up with Christ and the people of Christ, whoever they are, wherever they may be found, not in some dead hierarchy. Why on earth should we read Whites book in addition to Scripture? He wasnt talking to me. His debate opponents have included scholars such as Bart Ehrman, John Dominic Crossan, Marcus Borg, Robert M. Price, Joe Ventilacion of Iglesia ni Cristo[19] and popularizers such as Dan Barker and John Shelby Spong[20] James White has criticized fundamentalist views and King James Onlyism. Posts are filled with illustrations of the situation that make White out ot be the devil and yet Akin seems to have clean hands. During the recent debate between Dr. James White and Dr. Peter Van Kleeck, there was a brief discussion about Matthew 5:18 and the meaning of jot and tittle. 10:16). The Apostles were empowered by our Saviour to forgive sins Matter why would someone go through the bother? 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